Sunday, April 14All That Matters

How Amazon is Allowing Flashlights to Get Out of Hand

by Ekiph


How Amazon is Allowing Flashlights to Get Out of Hand




View Reddit by Ekiph – View Source

33 Comments

  • predictingzepast

    I’ve looked up what a 100k lumin flashlight would actually cost, and although it lists ‘Emergency fire starter’ as one of its uses, I can’t justify spending $700 on a flashlight, especially one I’d probably never even get the chance to actually use

    Reply
  • TehJohnny

    We need real units of measurement for these things: how many pairs of sunglasses do you have to wear to look into the light comfortably.

    Reply
  • fprintf

    I rely on /r/flashlight to tell me which flashlights to buy. I bought two based on their recommendations and they were awesome!

    For the record, I wanted 18650 based flashlights last year and after a search over there I ordered (not affiliate links):

    – [Wurkkos FC11 handheld LED flashlight](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZZ2YFKD/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

    – [Sofirn SP40A Headlamp](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09JKDCJBH/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

    I’ve been super happy with both.

    Reply
  • 0ogaBooga

    Same shit happens with climbing ropes. Hundreds of fake unrated products listed above quality manufacturers like beal or black diamond.

    Someone’s going to die, but Amazon doesn’t give a shit.

    Reply
  • Waffleline

    I worked as an investigator at Amazon spotting counterfeit, materially different, etc. Basically this type of stuff. I made a quick rundown on what would happen when a device like this gets a customer complain.

    1. Task arrives. The investigator does a quick scan of what the issues are and if the account is related blocked accounts to insta-block it due to relations. They have about 15 minutes to complete a full CCR/NA/Matdiff/etc investigation
    2. “Advertised as 90k lumens, probably doesn’t even reach 1k”. The investigator has no idea what a lumen is. Checks the current enforcement policy and there is no mention about lumens anywhere. Seller is most likely aware which is why they are doing this in the first place.
    3. Items are not CCR(counterfeit) either because it’s no brand or just a generic brand. When the investigator checks in the brand registry tool, they discover that there is no other seller claiming the “Xiawou” brand, which as per policy means that even though there is no official registration for this brand in any government/international brand registry, as far as Amazon is concerned this makes the guy the brand owner. No need to ask for brand documentation. There are a thousand variants of the Xiawou brand like Xiowou, Xiuwu, Xiwau, etc. All 100% different brands as per policies. This means that since they are generic, it doesn’t matter how many “fake” complaints the item gets, it’s not fake, and basically, it’s the buyer’s fault.
    4. The investigator checks for other issues. Some people say “not as advertised”, but Amazon doesn’t enforce a third-party lumen test of any sort, so complaints about lumens can be ignored. Could it be wrong item? No, people are getting what they ordered. Matdiff? No, the flashlight is made of the materials and components that they are advertised to be. Of course, maybe Amazon could have highly specialized investigators trained to verify what kind of LED the flashlight has and take a more educated guess based on pictures and realize there is no way a certain particular type of LED could output so much light. But then that would mean hiring more investigators just to make a highly specialized task, which means less money. Preposterous, what about frugality?
    5. A coworker suggests that perhaps this could be transferred to CERT/PAT because “they have no policies” and technically can request anything to do the right thing. But CERT/PAT program managers need a way to control the team, so instead of SOPs which are a no no, they came up with “guidelines that need to be followed always”, completely different thing. Nothing in the not-an-SOP mentions lumens either. CERT can only request supplier information, which doesn’t matter because this is a non-branded item or the seller is the “brand owner”. Whatever supplier/invoice information the seller sends is good as per not-an-SOP.
    6. The CERT investigator has to “Pass” the investigation. Under 15 minutes, he gets to keep their job too!

    Reply
  • zerozed

    It’s a very informative video. And it highlights a problem with serious safety implications that the host doesn’t articulate.

    This exact same issue is present not only with flashlights, but all types of lights being sold on Amazon. The same type of hyperbole exists on listings for car lights (e.g. lightbars) and bicycle lights. As an avid cyclist, I’ve purchased a number of led lights which are absolutely critical for safety. When a vendor misrepresents those specs, it literally can be a significant safety issue. Many, if not most, road cyclists use lights during daytime to enhance their visibility. If a light cannot be seen then the rider is at much greater risk. If you ride at night and use a light to illuminate the road (or trail) you absolutely need to be able to rely on your light to both provide sufficient illumination and to last as long as advertised – otherwise you’ll find yourself riding in complete darkness.

    Obviously there are plenty of other items on Amazon that might be sketchy and present a risk, but as it pertains to lights I think it’s important to point out that false claims like highlighted in the video need to be taken seriously if you are shopping for an item used for safety.

    Reply
  • RainOrigami

    amazon is a shit show in general. I was looking for a decent digital camera and most of those with high reviews had a ton of reviews about paper clips, coffee mugs or coffee makers, not about the actual product.

    Reply
  • yes_i_am_trolling

    You’re assuming that your styrofoam dome will capture the total flashlight output, which might be true for your control but may not be true for flashlights with 2 orders of magnitude higher lumen output. So there’s two things here: 1) Is there leakage? I.e. light escaping the dome before it can be measured. The leakage for a 1000 lumen flashlight may not be the same % as a 10k or 100k lumen flashlight. and 2) Does your measuring device have a saturation point (Ie after 1000 lumens its ability to absorb light drops off)? I’m sure there are bad marketing practices going on, but the experiment also seems to have its own potential flaws too. These needs to be addressed before any claims like “1% lumens as advertised”

    Reply
  • Eskaminagaga

    This issue could be easily solved if Amazon just allowed you to filter out products that are made in specific countries.

    Reply
  • JustAbicuspidRoot

    I just purchased a 10 Watt Blue LASER on amazon, it was listed as a “Flash light”, but it can burn paper from at least 10 feet away, I don’t dare shine it up into the sky or turn it on without the Red filter safety glasses.

    People are worried about flashlights being sold on amazon, yet in the USA you can buy a machine gun from one of 300 gun stores in every zip code.

    But yeah, let’s complain about bright flash lights.

    Reply
  • orangegreyy

    Go to the flashlight subreddit to see what lights you should be getting. They know their shit and will tell you exactly whats good

    Reply
  • HerbaciousTea

    At this point, I only use amazon if I am buying a specific product from a specific brand from the brand’s own listings, something that cannot be copied, or if I’m buying something so simple or replaceable that a knockoff version would work just as well.

    Ex: Cheap paintbrushes. Literally any garbage synthetic on a stick will work for some aspects of painting that are going to tear the brush up anyway. Sometimes you just need *any* brush, and a pack of 20 cheapo brushes for a few dollars is perfectly acceptable.

    The good brushes, you buy a known brand from their first party store or from a brick and mortar art supplier.

    On the other end of the spectrum, a highly specific brand name product, like computer hardware, that can’t be replicated. As long as you ensure you are buying only new components, and only directly from a known seller’s store to avoid getting refurbished and potentially broken components, Amazon works fine for that.

    Anything else, expect Amazon’s highly abuseable listings and methodology of storing like products in mixed batches to fuck with your order and potentially get you a cheap knockoff even if you ordered the name brand, because they all got put in the same lot.

    Incredibly specific and incredibly generic. Anything in-between where you need decent quality but not something completely unique or proprietary, and amazon WILL fuck you.

    Reply
  • series_hybrid

    I deal frequently with Chinese products. This is why forums are so valuable concerning products. I can get a great product at a really good price, but the ads and catalog listings are filled with ridiculous lies.

    Reply
  • El_Pinguino

    I would be more likely to buy stuff on Amazon if they had like a blue checkmark program that indicated which companies are at least registered in the United States and have some accountability.

    Reply

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